just purchased helix 150cc for $300

[SLESTAK75]

With the Marvel Mystery Oil you can actually run it a while. Maybe through one tank of gas for the break in then change it out. If it comes out filthy you may consider doing it again.

[zman007007]

welppppppppp drained the oil a while ago and poured it into another container straining it with a paper towel over it and everything looks ok so far.

[zman007007]

I will apologise for my original post tho saying they never changed the oil because the oil filter screen was reinstalled upside down. LOL there was not much of anything in the filter but there was some grit in the bottom part of the plug. wasnt nothing anything unusual though.

[zman007007]

So I am going to go with the 5w-30 oil and 6 ounces of marvel mystery oil to start with As I planned, and Mr. slestak agreed, I can run maybe a tank of gas with this blend then change it and see what it looks like.

[zman007007]

Does anyone else see a problem with this, if so please say so and explain why. thanks

[SLESTAK75]

I disagree. The reason is because I didnt like the look on your face when you said it.

[zman007007]

so thats one that says go for it as long as I can do it with a happy face. lol

[zman007007]

well finally got it back together and now I am having trouble with it firing. when I first got it, it wasnt firing and I installed a new CDI and coil pack on it. and it seemed to be firing good. now with the spark plug in the holder and against the engine to ground it, it will spark one time as soon as I turn the switch on, without turning it to start but just to run, and only ocassionly after that. I may have to track all the wires on this thing since it looks like for some reason everything was cut and butt spliced back together on the wiring.

[jmansracerocket]

I would first start with ur ground wire then like u said check all ur connections, disconnect everything clean everything then put the wires back together

[SLESTAK75]

Agreed. Could VERY easily be a bad connection with all of the butt splices. Check them for corrosion. Would be great to get them all soldered.

[zman007007]

well gents, if you want to work on your cart and keep Murphy away, now is the time to do it. Its obvious he has moved in here with me. I cut all the butt connectors out and soldered them back together and now I have no fire to the spark plug at all. Is it also normal for it to show only 90 psi ,since I just rebuilt it. I know its not going to be higher till it gets to run a little and seat the rings in.

[xlint89]

Check the obvious stuff first. Is the kill switch grounded? Does yours have a brake safety switch? (maybe it's now actually working)

As for the compression, I would think you should be slightly higher than 90, and yes it will rise once the rings seat. Did you "clock" the piston ring gaps? (10, 2, and 6 O'clock positions) How big are the ring gaps?

[zman007007]

Hi xlint I just remembered I didnt hold the throttle wide open when checking the compression. would it make that much diff.? also I didnt exactually gap the rings where you said but I did stagger them.

[zman007007]

both kill switches are disconnected.

[zman007007]

I didnt check the ring gaps

[xlint89]

Not holding the throttle open when doing a compression test will make a HUGE difference. I bet you get over 120 if you redo it with it open.

[SLESTAK75]

Check to see if you have juice going to the coil. If yes, probably bad coil. If no, check for juice to the CDI. If yes, probably bad CDI. If no, keep tracing wires until you find voltage. Try to "hotwire" the key switch if you have one. Run position on switch could be corroded.

@xlint. Could you tell any difference with that 28mm carb??

[zman007007]

I will check the comp. again tomm. if we dont get flooded here. cart is outside right now. supposed to rain pretty hard here tomm. had some today but not too bad. I pulled the switch and checked it. it had fire coming from battery and then checked the cdi , it had fire going to it, then happened to notice spark plug was firing like it ought to fire. stuck it back in and nothing. pulled plug again and it wasnt firing. duhhhhhhhhhhhh LOL

[zman007007]

So I just ordered a new wiring harness, 2 new starter relays, and new ignition switch. I am going to get rid of all the butchered wires on this thing. the starter relay is ok but I went to take the nut off it today to replace one of the connectors on it and the little nut on it wrung off. It still had enuff threads underneath the other nut, to still use it though for testing.

[zman007007]

I ordered 2 relays because heck for 10 bucks a piece I will have a extra for my crossfire if I need it. That is the good part about the parts interchanging on these engines.

[zman007007]

I had some of my kin folk come up today. One of my nieces and one of my nephews. they both rode the crossfire and loved it. My nieces"s husband races go carts and she said they arent as much fun as this thing. I think they want to drive it home.They were both suprised of the smooth ride. You see, I live on a gravel road and it is very rutted right now. I am the only one that takes care of it, and I have not scraped it lately. I have just bought a new box scrape to go behind my tractor, so I will get it smoothed out soon. LOL

[zman007007]

Originally Posted by xlint89

Not holding the throttle open when doing a compression test will make a HUGE difference. I bet you get over 120 if you redo it with it open.

you were right again xlint, with the throttle pressed all the way down and spinning it over, compression is reading 145 psi now. makes me feel a lot better about the rebuild.

[zman007007]

it has rained about all day here, took the old seat off the frame and working on putting on the new one.

[bear]

Yeah it's been a "soggy-dog" here all day too, but I did manage to clean all the mud off both buggy's from yesterdays romp!

[xlint89]

Originally Posted by zman007007

you were right again xlint, with the throttle pressed all the way down and spinning it over, compression is reading 145 psi now. makes me feel a lot better about the rebuild.

Now that's going to be a good compression reading when those rings seat.

I know you feel ALOT better now.

[zman007007]

I believe it will be great compression once I get it cranked. The problem has been between it raining about every day here and work I havent had much time to work on it. I have a question about the power to the spark plug coil, which is, should it show 12 volt power to the coil when the switch is on in the run or start position of the key switch?

[xlint89]

That would be a good question to ask Tom, or another Helix owner since I don't have one.

Hopefully someone else can answer that one for you.

[SLESTAK75]

Your coil is fired by a signal from the CDI. So without the engine running you should NOT have power to the coil. The only scenario where you might have power at the coil would be if the CDI supplied power but not ground to the coil and triggered the coil by grounding it but I am pretty sure that is not the case.

[zman007007]

ok, no fire to the coil in the run position, but how about when engine is spinning over in start position? if not where does the coil get its initial fire from to make the plug fire? The magneto?

[Masteryota]

Going out on a limb here, but most coils will have 12v at the positive side terminal when in the on position, and the CDI will provide a ground when it sees the proper location/signal from the stator. This is whats called a ground side controlled circuit, and has been in use for decades in automobiles, and stands to reason why it would be used in our electronic ignition buggies. If you have a decent meter, with a min/max setting, you can see if the CDI is supplying a ground when turning over while in the resistance setting, or continuity setting, but it will only be a brief blip and most meters can't react fast enough for you to see it.

An ignition coil can be somewhat confusing, but in the simplest form, it has 2 coil windings inside, primary and secondary, the secondary is where you get the actual fire from, both coils hold a charge until the primary coil is supplied a ground, which causes the magnetic field inside to collapse, thus releasing the secondary circuit voltage through the high resistance plug wire to the plug and so on.

[zman007007]

hey master, I just checked and it is showing 12 volts to the switch, then 12 volts to the cdi and then no voltage to the coil in the run position, and even when turning it to start position it still only shows about .375 volts to the coil. this is both a new cdi and coil pack. it was firing great before I rebuilt the top end. it wasnt firing when I got it, so I put the cdi and coil on it and got it firing. then I rebuilt the top end and havent been able to crank it yet. it has no spark now whatsoever.

[Masteryota]

Thats odd, I would go back and double and triple check the wires, connectors and pins, and make sure something isn't loose or crossed. The likelihood of toasting a CDI without it running at all is slim. You are on the right track tracing the power side of the circuit, but with .3 volts, something is getting lost on its way. Also, be sure you have every ground hooked up, and the connections are clean, I can't tell you how many techs I have seen run circles around cars for something weird, and it ends up being a ground they left off or loose.

[zman007007]

yea master I understand the checking over and over again. I will if the dang rain ever lets up here. the buggy is outside right now so I have to work on it between rain showers and work. it has rained here for about the last week and they are calling for the same for about another week.

[zman007007]

my wife is just fussing because she cant get out and plant her garden.

[Masteryota]

I understand, we just finished up our monsoon season down here, I did manage to get some stuff done in the garage, but not alot.

[SLESTAK75]

Originally Posted by Masteryota

Going out on a limb here, but most coils will have 12v at the positive side terminal when in the on position, and the CDI will provide a ground when it sees the proper location/signal from the stator. This is whats called a ground side controlled circuit, and has been in use for decades in automobiles, and stands to reason why it would be used in our electronic ignition buggies. If you have a decent meter, with a min/max setting, you can see if the CDI is supplying a ground when turning over while in the resistance setting, or continuity setting, but it will only be a brief blip and most meters can't react fast enough for you to see it.

An ignition coil can be somewhat confusing, but in the simplest form, it has 2 coil windings inside, primary and secondary, the secondary is where you get the actual fire from, both coils hold a charge until the primary coil is supplied a ground, which causes the magnetic field inside to collapse, thus releasing the secondary circuit voltage through the high resistance plug wire to the plug and so on.

Thank you Yota. I stand corrected.

[zman007007]

so you are saying that I should have 12 volts going to the coil in the on position?

[Masteryota]

Yes, unless it is way different than normal electronic ignition.

For a reference, do the same checks on your running buggy, and note what you get.

[zman007007]

hey master, I just checked the crossfire and it has no fire either going to the coil in the on position. I didnt get to check the start position, started raining heavy. lol maybe I can check that part tomm. The crosfire is a ac cdi and the helix is a dc cdi.

[zman007007]

I just checked the crossfire and nothing, it shows no fire in the on position the start position, or with the engine running. I am checking all this with my fluke meter. I checked both on dc current, but should I check the crossfire in the ac mode since it is a ac cdi. just wondering since I saw above that I mentioned the crossfire is a ac cdi.

[Masteryota]

That question is likely best suited for Tom. I only deal with DC ignition stuff, and what AC stuff I do deal with is high voltage, like 200-300v AC in our hybrid cars.

[zman007007]

I just got my new switch in Friday, I tried it so I could eliminate it as a suspect, and still nothing new. Its sparks one time when I first turn on the switch and then stops as it starts turning over.

[zman007007]

how often does the stator go out on these engines? reason I ask is because I saw somewhere is says the magnet on the stator makes the coil fire. I know it works this way on a lawmower.

[zman007007]

well got her cranked, I cant believe it but I ordered a new stock cdi to go on it and plugged it in and it fired right up. I had to idle it up a little bit, but it is sitting outside purring now. What I cant believe is the new performance cdi went bad that fast, before it was even cranked.

[Masteryota]

Originally Posted by zman007007

well got her cranked, I cant believe it but I ordered a new stock cdi to go on it and plugged it in and it fired right up. I had to idle it up a little bit, but it is sitting outside purring now. What I cant believe is the new performance cdi went bad that fast, before it was even cranked.

I was thinking it was a CDI, but I knew you had a new one there. Glad to hear you got it running finally.

[zman007007]

well just put the air filter back on and letting it run at idle again for 10 minutes. the small hose on the front of the air filter housing had broke off but luckily for me they had saved it. they wanted $40 for a new housing, JB weld is a lot cheaper. it is holding fine so far, but if need be I will buy one for it.

[zman007007]

well took this old puppy out for its 2nd run today. 1st run it was running fine and was slamming a little when I put it in gear after adjusting it. I had idled it up for the break in. Today I idled it down and now it slips in and out of gear fine. I bought new cables for it in case I need them. Carried my GPS with me on the run and it ran 30 mph easy without pushing it. still babying it because of rebuilt top end. One more tank and its Hammer time. LOL

[Masteryota]

Glad to hear its running well, mine is down for a while waiting on parts

Oh well, its looks pretty clean in there, so hopefully it will pur like a rabid wolverine when I'm done.

[zman007007]

yea master its doing real good so far considering its my 1st rebuild. knock on wood. LOL

[zman007007]

well finally got around to changing the oil on the Helix with the marvel mystery oil in it. Everything looked clean as a whistle so I went ahead and put the 10w--40 back in it. I still plan on running out this tank of fuel before pushing it hard though. This is still only the second tank.

[zman007007]

master did you get yours to run yet?

[Masteryota]

Not yet, getting the engine back together and prepping the swingarm. I have a long weekend coming up after the 4th, so I should be able to at least get it mounted and start working on the controls and brakes.

[zman007007]

well finally, I have everything running well so far. So here finally I am ready to install the seat I bought for it. 1st pic is of the seat. the rest is where since it had no plywood back I had to cut and mount a piece in the frame of the seat frame, to fasten the back to. It had a plywood bottom but no back. A couple pics of this is where I have no idea what happened to the frame, whether is was done on a late Friday evening or by someone they just turned loose on it. It looks like the whole frame was built by someone that had no idea what was going on. About to go into the house after this but I will post more pics on the final part of it.

[zman007007]

I had to mount 2- 1 x 4 boards on the frame to make the seat high enough to clear the slide levers.

[Bigrustysr]

have used mystery oil for years -not long ago bought a 90 dodge van v8 at estate sale that hadnt run for years valves rattled so bad just knew was going to have to rebuild engine-put a full pint of MO in it ran for several min (30) cured the problem -- use it in carts all the time with great results

[zman007007]

yea it cleaned the inside of the engine very well from the appearance of the oil I drained out. I think I need to put the rest of it in my old truck. LOL

[2SlickNick]

seat looks nice.

[zman007007]

thanks Nick it was only $18 S& H was $20. figures huh LOL

[2SlickNick]

They get you one way or another LOL